Can We Talk About the WIRE discography to date?

[xxxMidgexxx]

Or is this discussion destined to fall by the wayside after 'Chairs Missing'?

(Read: After 'Pink Flag' for Lewdd.)

[lewdd]

I'm good for about 5-6 songs and then i have no interest

[xxxMidgexxx]

I'm good for about 5-6 songs and then i have no interest

[SamDBL]

Love the first two albums. Can you break down how they evolved after that?

[xxxMidgexxx]

Love the first two albums. Can you break down how they evolved after that?

"154" is their 3rd album and they were well on their way away from the crude 2 minute punky songs. 154 has an eerie Eno-esque quality. Somewhat dreamy and ethereal. Guitars SOAKED in effects. Its a tremendous accomplishment and TBH I've grown to like it a lot more than 'Chairs Missing'.



Imma gon' go into detail further this weekend.

[lewdd]

You should really do an album by album review and critique of their entire discography.

[version sound]

You should really do an album by album review and critique of their entire discography.

SOLD!

[xxxHunterxxx]

“Red Bark Tree” is the only post-80s album I’ve heard and it’s really good. I saw them at the Black Cat on that tour and they were excellent despite only playing three songs I knew.

[xxxMidgexxx]

WIRE 'Pink Flag' 1977.

I was only 10 when this album came out and I didn't even like the Sex Pistols or the Damned yet so 'Pink Flag' was nowhere close to being on my radar. It wasn't really until I started DJing on WSIA radio mid 80s that I started to pick up on them from the other older DJs who'd spin tracks from Wire on their show. And then through word of mouth, reading about them and just listening to a lot of college radio I later bought the cassette version of 'Pink Flag' with the 'Options R' bonus track. I was surprised at how bizarre and jagged/dry the guitar sound is on this. The songs though were very unique, artsy, tuneful and lyrically Wire are one of those bands where you THINK you MIGHT know what the singer is talking about, but probably not. 'Reuters' goes down as one of the greatest opening songs in all of post punk history. Through the years and many many albums later I'd grown to love them. I saw them only 2 x live (both times at Irving Plaza) though I had a ticket another time and had to miss it. Songs from this album has been covered by a LOT of bands; REM, Soulside, Rollins Band, Die Kreuzen, Sam's very own Track the Curse, Firehose etc...and I guess they're done well, but nothing compares to the original. Its really a perfect album. For the longest time I though the song 'Strange' was the 1 blemish on the record, but I've since caved in. Perfect album.

Aquaman was telling me that SST wanted to sign Wire at one point, but they wanted too much money.

Favorite track..."Mannequin" (which is also my favorite wire song ever)
And Wire are somewhere in my top 10 favorite bands of all time.

[xxxMidgexxx]

You should really do an album by album review and critique of their entire discography.

SOLD!

Aiight. You twisted my arm.

[lewdd]

No mention of Minor Trheat! How about Elastica ripping off the riff in Three Girl Mumba? Did Field Day get their name from "Field Day for the Sundays"? No mention of Down by Law covering "Mannequin"?

[JGJR]

Love the first two albums. Can you break down how they evolved after that?

"154" is their 3rd album and they were well on their way away from the crude 2 minute punky songs. 154 has an eerie Eno-esque quality. Somewhat dreamy and ethereal. Guitars SOAKED in effects. Its a tremendous accomplishment and TBH I've grown to like it a lot more than 'Chairs Missing'.



Imma gon' go into detail further this weekend.

I go back and forth, but most of the time my favorite is 154 as well. I'd definitely put that one and Chairs Missing on an all-time favorites list and used to play them both so much. I like Pink Flag a lot, too.

But to answer the initial question, they took a break and came back in the mid '80s with a much more industrial/synth/experimental sound that divided fan opinion. They also refused to play their older stuff during this period and even had a Wire cover band open for them at one point to satisfy older fans, but had some minor alternative/modern rock/MTV sorta hits like "Kidney Bingos" (incredible song) and later "Eardrum Buzz." They then took another break in the '90s and didn't come back until the early '00s. Those initial EPs and Send are much more harder-edged than anything they'd ever done before and explored new territory. I saw them around then at Irving Plaza and they were fantastic with the original lineup. Their subsequent records have them wedged nicely in 154-ish territory, breaking no new ground for them. I think they're all good, but generally not great. I always just go back to the 1st 3 and the singles from that time period.

[Fillavoid]

“Red Bark Tree” is the only post-80s album I’ve heard and it’s really good. I saw them at the Black Cat on that tour and they were excellent despite only playing three songs I knew.

I agree, Red Barked Tree is excellent. I also really like Object 47 from 2008. I was super excited when it first came out because I loved the song "One of Us". In retrospect, I was a little disappointed by the rest of the album because I felt it wasn't as strong as that song (although it's still good overall). Red Barked Tree, on the other hand, is great from start to finish. When I consider Wire's recent output, those two albums stand out to me. My problem is Wire became so prolific in the 2010's that I haven't kept up with everything, and while I enjoy what I've heard, it starts to blend together somewhat.

[Fillavoid]

Favorite track..."Mannequin" (which is also my favorite wire song ever)

Totally agree! Mannequin is right up there with "Outdoor Miner" and "Map Ref. 41°N 93°W" for me.

[xxxMidgexxx]

Favorite track..."Mannequin" (which is also my favorite wire song ever)

Totally agree! Mannequin is right up there with "Outdoor Miner" and "Map Ref. 41°N 93°W" for me.

DING!
DING!
DING!

3 for 3. The best tracks of each of the first 3 LPS.

[xxxMidgexxx]

No mention of Minor Trheat! How about Elastica ripping off the riff in Three Girl Mumba? Did Field Day get their name from "Field Day for the Sundays"? No mention of Down by Law covering "Mannequin"?

I'm not even going to attempt to mention all the notable bands that covered a song from this album. Too extensive. But at least you get the idea of the impact and influence of this album.

[Fillavoid]

Favorite track..."Mannequin" (which is also my favorite wire song ever)

Totally agree! Mannequin is right up there with "Outdoor Miner" and "Map Ref. 41°N 93°W" for me.

DING!
DING!
DING!

3 for 3. The best tracks of each of the first 3 LPS.

I'm with you there. Those tracks are ridiculously good, and they're certainly the highlights from those three albums. I will say, Ex Lion Tamer rates pretty high for me as well, though... it might be tied with Mannequin.

[lewdd]

My introduction to Wire was "12XU" on the Burning Ambitions 2LP compilation. After that was "Dot Dash" and "Options R" that someone put on a cassette mix for me. First time I heard "Mannequin" was when one of Sam's bands did a cover of it.

[xxxMidgexxx]

ALBUM #2

'Chairs Missing' (1978)



I remember Stabb and I talking about this record and he liked it a lot and IIRC, he liked it just as much as 'Pink Flag'. Many agree that it was the next logical step after 'Pink Flag'. The guitars are less jagged and they don't break up as much through the amps on the recording as they did on Pink Flag. And we start to see some fx as well as multi-tracking. It's a smoother production though the songs are still short. Sounds like they had a better tape machine(?) Fans who like the late 70's output still consider this 'acceptable Wire'. When I bought the CD, I liked it and played it often. Now I reflect on it and I don't think it's as good as either 'Pink Flag' nor the LP that followed; '154'. When I saw them, the played an incomprehensible version of 'I Am The Fly'. Toward the end of the song I remember looking at Pilster and told him the title. He had the album and knew the song, but we chuckled at the fact that it wasn't until the end that we finally realized what it was 'supposed' to be since the band twisted it up so much almost re-writing the song's music. When I play a Wire song from this album, its usually always 'Outdoor Miner'. Beautifully lush vocal song and one of their all time greatest.




Favorite song: 'Outdoor Miner'

[JGJR]

Chairs Missing is a perfect Lp and "Outdoor Miner" is a perfect pop song (especially in its single form, but I love the version on the album, too), but it's the combo of "Men 2nd" going into Marooned" that just stopped me in my tracks when I first heard it. Just pure genius. "Chairs missing" is a British euphemism for insanity IIRC and the whole thing feels so disorienting; it's often described as a punk version of Syd Barrett-era Floyd or his solo stuff. I don't disagree.

[patient_ot]

Chairs Missing has always been my favorite, but I love the first 3 albums. Never got into the later stuff as much, just never gave it time. I heard bits and pieces through friends over the years.

[JGJR]

Chairs Missing has always been my favorite, but I love the first 3 albums. Never got into the later stuff as much, just never gave it time. I heard bits and pieces through friends over the years.

I think there are 2 types of Wire fans. I'm definitely one of those who focuses on those 1st 3 Lps and I think most are probably in that boat. I like what I've heard of the later stuff, too, just nowhere near as much. Maybe one day I'll fully celebrate the entire catalog like some I know, but I dunno.

[xxxMidgexxx]

I'm definitely one of those who focuses on those 1st 3 Lps and I think most are probably in that boat.

I call them '70's Wire Purists'. But yr missing out of a tremendous amount of great music. I will cover that in this brief course.

[patient_ot]

I wouldn't say I've disliked the later stuff either, just never gave it enough time. Too many other things vying for my time and money in the music world, so it fell on the backburner like so many other things.

[JGJR]

I wouldn't say I've disliked the later stuff either, just never gave it enough time. Too many other things vying for my time and money in the music world, so it fell on the backburner like so many other things.

Pretty much where I'm at. I've seen them 3x; only the 1st time with the original lineup in 2002 was truly remarkable; other 2 times were fine, but didn't have the same impact/intensity and that 1st time, I dind't even recognize any of the songs except for a barely recognizable "Pink Flag."

I've also heard about 3-4 of the 2000s albums. I like them, but none have stuck with me for more than a handful of plays.

[xxxMidgexxx]

... 1st time with the original lineup in 2002 was truly remarkable.

Yup, I saw that tour. Great show, but very little recognizable material.

[xxxMidgexxx]

ALBUM #4:
'The Ideal Copy' 1987

Ok. So, I'm going on record right now saying that their 4th album 'The Ideal Copy' is my favorite Wire album and I'm not arguing with 'Pink Flag' purists about this. Both sounds are wonderful. BUT this is my favorite. I also reserve the right to change my mind at any given time about my favorite album.

They'd reunited after 6 years after releasing '154' and the early short bursts of fuzz and art punk are completely gone at this point. This is now musically qualifying as a different band. I'd bought this CD used somewhere and after a few spins, it was obvious that "Ahead" was the single, and a GREAT one. I'd even seen a video for it. Obviously trying to fit in with New Order and the new wave/dance scene with this new sound. 'Point of Collapse' is a FANTASTIC opening song and though I probably would have hated the programmed drums back then, I grew to love them later on. Still do. Programming drums/beats requires skill and too many people forget that. Lyrics are typical Colin Newman. And they had Gareth Jones produce this who did a ton of notable work in the 80s electronic-alt-dance-experimental scene. The studio album ends with "Over Theirs"; one of the creepiest tracks in their history. Rhythmic, goth shit that reminds of club music.

Favorite Track: 'Ahead'

[pedro]

Dearest xxxMidgexxx,

I am the stereotypical first three albums Wire fan. I saw Wire at the Paradise in Boston on the tour for The Ideal Copy and frankly enjoyed the openers, the Wire cover band Ex-Lion Tamers, much more than the real band. The only song I can name from the second era is the title track from The Ideal Copy. I have been curious about some of the more recent records, but have never pulled the trigger.

As someone who likes guitar/bass/drums music, but appreciates New Order to a certain degree, do you think there is any reason for me to check this stuff out? If so, any chance you can get me a "John's Favorite post-Chairs Missing Wire Songs" comp or playlist or however it is you kids listen to this stuff now?

Regardless of your response, I will continue to check out this thread. Maybe reading about the post-Chairs Missing stuff is enough even if I am too lazy (and/or cheap) to check it out.

Thank you.

Your pal,

pedro

[lewdd]

What happened to album #3 on this thread?

[pedro]

Dearest xxxMidgexxx,

I am the stereotypical first three albums Wire fan. I saw Wire at the Paradise in Boston on the tour for The Ideal Copy and frankly enjoyed the openers, the Wire cover band Ex-Lion Tamers, much more than the real band. The only song I can name from the second era is the title track from The Ideal Copy. I have been curious about some of the more recent records, but have never pulled the trigger.

As someone who likes guitar/bass/drums music, but appreciates New Order to a certain degree, do you think there is any reason for me to check this stuff out? If so, any chance you can get me a "John's Favorite post-Chairs Missing Wire Songs" comp or playlist or however it is you kids listen to this stuff now?

Regardless of your response, I will continue to check out this thread. Maybe reading about the post-Chairs Missing stuff is enough even if I am too lazy (and/or cheap) to check it out.

Thank you.

Your pal,

pedro

Looking at Lew's message made me realize that in my brain I had 154 and Chairs Missing swapped chronologically. Oops.

[xxxMidgexxx]

What happened to album #3 on this thread?

I KNEW you'd ask that. I thought I'd already covered '154' for Sam, but I will revise.

[xxxMidgexxx]

Dearest xxxMidgexxx,

I am the stereotypical first three albums Wire fan. I saw Wire at the Paradise in Boston on the tour for The Ideal Copy and frankly enjoyed the openers, the Wire cover band Ex-Lion Tamers, much more than the real band. The only song I can name from the second era is the title track from The Ideal Copy. I have been curious about some of the more recent records, but have never pulled the trigger.

As someone who likes guitar/bass/drums music, but appreciates New Order to a certain degree, do you think there is any reason for me to check this stuff out? If so, any chance you can get me a "John's Favorite post-Chairs Missing Wire Songs" comp or playlist or however it is you kids listen to this stuff now?

Regardless of your response, I will continue to check out this thread. Maybe reading about the post-Chairs Missing stuff is enough even if I am too lazy (and/or cheap) to check it out.

Thank you.

Your pal,

pedro

You're probably not alone in having enjoyed 'X Lion Tamers' more than Wire at that point. To bring along a cover band was either a genius move on their part, or a catastrophic idea depending on who you ask. They faced the outcome of having their audience worn out with the early hits before they even stepped on stage. Then again, they really just had gotten tired of people wanting them to have the early stuff consume too much of their onstage set time. I sorta get that. Even when I saw them in 2002, they were still uncompromising with their selections. I will build a 'post '154' faves set as I go along. They also have a comp disk called "The A List" which is a FAIRLY good collection of their highlights after the non-punk rock cutover.

The BIGGEST difference between Wire and New Order is that Wire's electronica is much more quirky, experimental and sometimes a bit damaging. New Order's script straight for pop sensibilities. I go for both. And both bands still release terrific music to this day.

[pedro]

I will look for The A List.

Thank you.

[xxxMidgexxx]

I will look for The A List.

It's good, but it only goes up to 1990. Can't f'n believe that there's 30 more years of music after that.

Are we that old??

[lewdd]

I will look for The A List.

It's good, but it only goes up to 1990. Can't f'n believe that there's 30 more years of music after that.

Are we that old??

Some of you are

[xxxMidgexxx]

I will look for The A List.

It's good, but it only goes up to 1990. Can't f'n believe that there's 30 more years of music after that.

Are we that old??

Some of you are

Lewdd, its 2PM on Wed. Shouldn't you be drinking? Or maybe you are...?

[lewdd]

I may have a few tonight to take the edge off.

[xxxMidgexxx]

I may have a few tonight to take the edge off.

Make me food, deliver it and then you're free to leave.

[lewdd]

I may have a few tonight to take the edge off.

Make me food, deliver it and then you're free to leave.

I may do that one weekend and surprise you. Looks like 2 hour drive each way and probably $50 worth of tolls.

[xxxMidgexxx]

I may have a few tonight to take the edge off.

Make me food, deliver it and then you're free to leave.

I may do that one weekend and surprise you. Looks like 2 hour drive each way and probably $50 worth of tolls.

As long as you're making me BBQ, I'm sure you can afford the extra $50

[lewdd]

12XU

[pedro]

Hey xxxMIdgexxx and others:

What do you think of the 1976 Demo bootleg? 5 piece Wire playing punk. It's tough because it's more of a practice tape, but the material is definitely rougher than Pink Flag and only "Feeling Called Love" was re-recorded for the album, minus the solos and slowed down. I listened for the first time in along time this morning and, while it's not bad, I think it is more "interesting" than "good". I don't know the story of George Gill's tenure with the band. He certainly added some unexpected guitar solos to the mix. I assume that's him. Maybe that's why the sacked him?

https://www.discogs.com/Wire-1976-Demo/release/3836933

[xxxMidgexxx]

Hey xxxMIdgexxx and others:

What do you think of the 1976 Demo bootleg? 5 piece Wire playing punk. It's tough because it's more of a practice tape, but the material is definitely rougher than Pink Flag and only "Feeling Called Love" was re-recorded for the album, minus the solos and slowed down. I listened for the first time in along time this morning and, while it's not bad, I think it is more "interesting" than "good". I don't know the story of George Gill's tenure with the band. He certainly added some unexpected guitar solos to the mix. I assume that's him. Maybe that's why the sacked him?

https://www.discogs.com/Wire-1976-Demo/release/3836933

This is all new news to me. I have never seen or heard this. And with titles like 'Mary is a Dyke' and 'Johnny Piss Off', Imma guess that there's a reason this is a bootleg.

[lewdd]

scooped

[xxxMidgexxx]

scooped

Wire have evolved too far in the past 40 + years for me to take a 1976 punk album like this seriously from them. Granted, I can get onboard with pissed off, raw punk rock pretty much all the time, but it's situational really. Now should you not be fixing my BBQ for delivery???

[pedro]

You should give it a listen. It's not something you will go back to often, if ever, but it's interesting. The lead guitar just sticks out so much when you think about Pink Flag.

[xxxMidgexxx]

ALBUM #5
A Bell Is a Cup
AKA: 'A Bell is a Cup until It Is Struck' (1988)



I didn't play this album a lot as I bought it way out of sequence. I tried to get into it, but I don't think it was a particularly strong follow up to 'The Ideal Copy'. Without having to look up any information, I knew right away from hearing the song, that 'Kidney Bingos' was a single and I was right. As a whole, it sounds like a sparse production and sorta thin. Its all machines and samples making the music now. Or at least that's what it sounds like to me. Even the bass sounds like a synthesized programmed instrument. There's a nice dark, eerie track called 'A Public Place' and "Follow the Locust" has a decent driving rhythm, but chronologically, I think this was Wire's low point at that snapshot in time. Colin's vocals seem to be struggling to find a relative and cohesive melody in the music for the bulk of these songs.

Favorite track: 'Kidney Bingos'

[xxxMidgexxx]

ALBUM #6
IBTABA (1989)
(AKA: 'It's Beginning To And Back Again')



This one gets a hell of a lot more play than the previous album 'Bell is a Cup'. To me, its where they started really just fucking with people with no plot nor pattern. And obviously not caring. Example; on the previous album, there was a track called 'The Finest Drops' and on this album we're given 'Finest Drops. Tracks sound NOTHING alike. I guess its what a band would do if they were really in love with a certain lyric and wanted to have a 2nd song written around it. And this is the 3rd time they'd used the lyrics and released a version of 'Over Theirs'. If I was a cynic, I would say that they're too fucking lazy to write and memorize lyrics for fresh material. Whatevs.

All said, this album has a very cool flow to it. Colin instantly recognizable and sounding lush, but the 'Eardrum Buzz' version on this album doesn't come anywhere close to the 12" remix which is also included on this CD. And the 'In Vivo' mix here is not as good as the Club mix. Shit, waaaay too much to unpack at this point.

Still very rhythmic and dancey with loops galore.

Favorite track: 'Eardrum Buzz' 12" Version

[xxxMidgexxx]

Album #7
Manscape (1990)

So this is a pretty big jump for Wire and I'm a HUGE fan of this album. It's their most polished and obvious attempt at a radio friendly release as of 1990. DAMN! Over 30 years ago. The sampling sounds are more like conventional instrumentation as opposed to hybrid snippets of noise. Sometimes symphonic, xylophones, piano/electric piano, drums (live and sequenced), and more ethereal sounds for big clubs. The melodies are more pronounced. TBH...this is what Queen's "Hot Space" album COULD have sounded like instead of the fiasco it turned out to me.
The very first time I'd heard this was in 1993 in a tour van going across Germany. The song 'Stampede' came on the tape deck at 3AM while we zipped down the Autobahn in the snow. I remember that night trying 'hash' for the first and only time in my life. And the sounds of this recording were quite clear and euphoric. Listening to this album now brings back wonderful memories.



Song about the fall of the Eastern Bloc.

[xxxMidgexxx]

Recent Wire interview for those who may care.

Spin: I read that instead of guitar solos, you perform something you call a “guitar event.” Why does the band eschew guitar solos?

"We all just thought guitar solos were a bit naff. The early ‘70s were full of promise, but then [in] the mid-‘70s the whole musical world split and suddenly you had later prog and three-hour guitar solos or whatever. This was the music that was not interesting. Soloing is weird…it’s a bit egoistic unless you’re really, really good. It’s just like, “Look at me!” It’s just not very interesting. "

https://www.spin.com/2021/06/wire-bruce-gilbert-colin-newman-interview/?fbclid=IwAR2u-0NSfnLxbddsB4QyJoqv2bOgLm1zFJHVLJW-jHVzyUAO-3Ghn7efhOw