Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby captain2man » Thu Apr 19, 2018 1:27 pm

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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby Hal » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:50 pm

Nice review, thanks for posting. Love that record.

Is the Dischord 1st four 7"s reissues happening? Somebody mentioned it here a while back.
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby xxxHunterxxx » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:05 pm

Cool stuff. There was time left over at the end of the SOA recording session so the Snakes recorded two instrumentals: “Fixing A Chair” and “Riot, Riot, Smash It Up.” They remain unreleased and, according to the Snakes, sound eerily like SOA.
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby captain2man » Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:57 pm

That's some great info. Exactly the type of tidbits I'm hoping come out of the woodwork.

Thanks for checking out the blog. I'm not even sure where to begin with the next one.
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby JGJR » Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:15 pm

Great and very fair review; you point out why I've never been the biggest fan of some of these very early Dischord releases (with some major exceptions and not just the next one up and others from that same band) but enjoy it for what it is and recognize its importance. I'm a Rollins defender myself. Who's Got the 10 1/2? is a formative album for me and what I heard first, so there you go (though I had heard "TV Party" before that).
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby version sound » Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:50 pm

I (again) tried to comment on the blog and had no luck. Anyway, I think people who came to hardcore later tend to underestimate stuff like SOA and Teen Idles because they have always lived in a world where there was a wealth of hardcore to choose from, but keep in mind that records weren't coming out 50 a week like they are now. These records existed in a world where hardcore was still very new and there was a limited supply. Even comparing them to what came 2 years later is kind of unfair, IMO, because hardcore had exploded at that point. I love this record. It's my favorite thing Henry ever did (with Damaged a close second). I can listen to it over and over and over and never get sick of it. Historical note: Henry basically put this record out and used the Dischord name, so what could have been a label just for Ian and Jeff's stuff became something more than that thanks to Henry. Can't wait for number 3 (the second most overrated record in hardcore).
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby version sound » Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:55 pm

xxxHunterxxx wrote:Cool stuff. There was time left over at the end of the SOA recording session so the Snakes recorded two instrumentals: “Fixing A Chair” and “Riot, Riot, Smash It Up.” They remain unreleased and, according to the Snakes, sound eerily like SOA.


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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby captain2man » Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:50 am

version sound wrote:I (again) tried to comment on the blog and had no luck. Anyway, I think people who came to hardcore later tend to underestimate stuff like SOA and Teen Idles because they have always lived in a world where there was a wealth of hardcore to choose from, but keep in mind that records weren't coming out 50 a week like they are now. These records existed in a world where hardcore was still very new and there was a limited supply. Even comparing them to what came 2 years later is kind of unfair, IMO, because hardcore had exploded at that point. I love this record. It's my favorite thing Henry ever did (with Damaged a close second). I can listen to it over and over and over and never get sick of it. Historical note: Henry basically put this record out and used the Dischord name, so what could have been a label just for Ian and Jeff's stuff became something more than that thanks to Henry. Can't wait for number 3 (the second most overrated record in hardcore).


It's a bummer because this is exactly the type of conversation I want to generate with these posts. I wonder why it's not working for you. I've gotten a few comments so far, and some have posted anonymously, so you don't have to create an account if you don't want to. Not sure what's happening.

In any case - I really want to be clear that these posts aren't designed to be reviews. I'm not writing record reviews here, although, ultimately, I'm going to express an opinion - but my intention is entirely different than people who actually write reviews and try to make firm judgments on the worthiness of an album.

In a vacuum, I would like both the Teen Idles & S.O.A. records - but let's be honest - if these same two records came out with no other future points to connect these bands to - they would probably have been mostly forgotten.

I think it's OK to acknowledge the historical importance of these records and, in my opinion, they are far more important historically than they are musically - but there's nothing wrong with that.

I love going through the evolution of a band, or an artist, or, in this case, several artists and bands - and a label - and really an entire region. Following the line from Teen Idles through Fugazi and beyond is an interesting one and makes sense as you go along the path from one to the other.

These artists did get better - and well they should! I think the S.O.A. record is pretty cool despite my criticisms, but I could never agree that Rollins didn't go on to do far better things.

You'll also be disappointed in my next post, because I think the first Minor Threat 7" is brain shattering. It's absolutely perfect from start to finish and is the first major plateau in the evolution of sound that Teen Idles and S.O.A. were reaching for.

If Teen Idles and S.O.A. were Blue Cheer and the MC5, then the first Minor Threat 7" is the first Sabbath album. Hmm...maybe I'll use that...
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby version sound » Sat Apr 21, 2018 1:24 pm

captain2man wrote:In a vacuum, I would like both the Teen Idles & S.O.A. records - but let's be honest - if these same two records came out with no other future points to connect these bands to - they would probably have been mostly forgotten.

I think it's OK to acknowledge the historical importance of these records and, in my opinion, they are far more important historically than they are musically - but there's nothing wrong with that.

These artists did get better - and well they should! I think the S.O.A. record is pretty cool despite my criticisms, but I could never agree that Rollins didn't go on to do far better things.

You'll also be disappointed in my next post, because I think the first Minor Threat 7" is brain shattering. It's absolutely perfect from start to finish and is the first major plateau in the evolution of sound that Teen Idles and S.O.A. were reaching for.



I respectfully disagree. I heard these records at a time when the only thing Rollins had gone on to do was Damaged and the only thing Ian and Jeff had done was Minor Threat (and Out of Step was a current release). I personally disagree that Rollins did better. My War was basically the end for me with Black Flag, and while I actually liked early Rollins Band better than late BF, I never liked either better than (or even close to as much as) No Policy or Damaged. With MT, I do prefer OOS to Minor Disturbance, but I like Minor Disturbance better than the first 2 EPs. And Fugazi, great as they were, never even came close to what those guys did before that (for me).

Tastes differ. Probably the biggest difference between mine and yours (and lots of other people on this board) is that I'm not a hook guy and never have been. I'm not even sure I could say what attracts me to a record, other than I know it when I hear it. Minor Threat, at no fault of their own, were largely responsible for the development of generic hardcore. People heard that first EP and turned it into a template where there hadn't really been one before. Plenty of great stuff came out later, a lot of it heavily influenced by that record, but the stuff that really appeals to me is from that '79-'81(ish) time period when hardcore was still finding its way. Long story short, the impact of that first MT has been somewhat blunted over the years (for me) because so damn many people adopted that sound that it kind of ruined it for me. I listen to it these days and feel like "yeah, that's what hardcore sounds like" without really feeling any kind of uniqueness in it. Same with the Negative Approach EP. They are great records, but my enjoyment of them has been diminished by their endless replication over the last 35+ years.
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby FlexMyHead » Sat Apr 21, 2018 6:46 pm

Here is what grandpa Obik had to say about this release:

I'm not terribly fond of this record. It doesn't seem right to call it "generic" since hardcore was still in its infancy, but even next to the Teen Idles, Necros, and GI this record seems inadequate. The music is rudimentary at best and Henry's limited vocal range, while fitting with the boneheaded lyrics (Public Defender: when you see a cop coming you better move quick / because he's gonna hit you with his stick / it doesn't matter what you've done / you're gonna suffer for his fun / etc.), is a real liability. I'm curious about why this stuff was released when their demo tape (excerpted on the 20 Years of Dischord box and Flex Your Head, and bootlegged on a 7" some years back) is smokin'.


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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby JGJR » Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:09 am

version sound wrote:I (again) tried to comment on the blog and had no luck. Anyway, I think people who came to hardcore later tend to underestimate stuff like SOA and Teen Idles because they have always lived in a world where there was a wealth of hardcore to choose from, but keep in mind that records weren't coming out 50 a week like they are now. These records existed in a world where hardcore was still very new and there was a limited supply. Even comparing them to what came 2 years later is kind of unfair, IMO, because hardcore had exploded at that point. I love this record. It's my favorite thing Henry ever did (with Damaged a close second). I can listen to it over and over and over and never get sick of it. Historical note: Henry basically put this record out and used the Dischord name, so what could have been a label just for Ian and Jeff's stuff became something more than that thanks to Henry. Can't wait for number 3 (the second most overrated record in hardcore).


Curious what you think the first most overrated record in HC is.
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby JGJR » Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:17 am

version sound wrote:Probably the biggest difference between mine and yours (and lots of other people on this board) is that I'm not a hook guy and never have been. I'm not even sure I could say what attracts me to a record, other than I know it when I hear it. Minor Threat, at no fault of their own, were largely responsible for the development of generic hardcore. People heard that first EP and turned it into a template where there hadn't really been one before. Plenty of great stuff came out later, a lot of it heavily influenced by that record, but the stuff that really appeals to me is from that '79-'81(ish) time period when hardcore was still finding its way. Long story short, the impact of that first MT has been somewhat blunted over the years (for me) because so damn many people adopted that sound that it kind of ruined it for me. I listen to it these days and feel like "yeah, that's what hardcore sounds like" without really feeling any kind of uniqueness in it. Same with the Negative Approach EP. They are great records, but my enjoyment of them has been diminished by their endless replication over the last 35+ years.


I think you nailed it. I definitely need some sort of hooks (even a vocal one if not a conventional guitar or keyboard-based one or something though obviously you don't find too much of the latter in hardcore) to enjoy something more than just a little and to keep playing it over and over and over, least in any sort of rock music with vocals (instrumental stuff, jazz, et al. is a whole 'nother story). That's exactly why (well that and other reasons, musical tightness, etc.), at least for me, Minor Threat are more popular and IMO way better than Teen Idles and S.O.A. But obviously that's an opinion.

What I don't get about your analysis is this. Most of the thrashy type stuff that to me is "generic hardcore" sounds way more like the direct line between the 1st Middle Class 7" to Minor Disturbance to some of the Boston stuff to the thousands of youth crew bands and their imitators. Minor Threat is basically pop-punk next to that stuff. In other words, Minor Threat's biggest lasting influence (despite their musical brilliance) is probably "straight edge" and everything that came with that, much to Ian's chagrin. Most hardcore (exception being Second Wind and bands of that sort and they almost don't count since it's MT's roadie backed by them) doesn't sound like them and isn't nearly as good. I would argue, however, that Can I Say used the later MT template and did something totally new with it and was just as brilliant. But Youth of Today (template for all the youth crew stuff) early on sounded like early SSD or maybe early DYS, not like Minor Threat.

NA 7" is another complete crusher leagues above most of the stuff discussed here.
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby version sound » Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:21 pm

Who was influenced by Minor Threat? Seriously??? Who wasn't would be a better question. All youth crew and straight edge bands for a start. You may think they were more influenced by SSD or DYS (I don't hear that at all), but those bands (Boston Crew) were also heavily influenced by MT. Why do you think the Dischord name is on The Kids Will Have Their Say? Not because Dischord actually had a hand in putting it out. I think you are forgetting what MT sounded like pre- break-up and reunion. They were a straight up hardcore band. Pop punk? Are you insane? You need to have your ears cleaned out, brother.

The most overrated HC record is the Negative Approach EP. It's great, and I love it, but there are plenty of other records I like as much or more. It seems like there was a time in the early/mid '00s that every single new band I heard was aping NA. They were great, but one NA is enough for me, I don't need 200.
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Re: Blogging Dischord - S.O.A. - No Policy

Postby JGJR » Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:28 pm

version sound wrote:Who was influenced by Minor Threat? Seriously??? Who wasn't would be a better question. All youth crew and straight edge bands for a start. You may think they were more influenced by SSD or DYS (I don't hear that at all), but those bands (Boston Crew) were also heavily influenced by MT. Why do you think the Dischord name is on The Kids Will Have Their Say? Not because Dischord actually had a hand in putting it out. I think you are forgetting what MT sounded like pre- break-up and reunion. They were a straight up hardcore band. Pop punk? Are you insane? You need to have your ears cleaned out, brother.

The most overrated HC record is the Negative Approach EP. It's great, and I love it, but there are plenty of other records I like as much or more. It seems like there was a time in the early/mid '00s that every single new band I heard was aping NA. They were great, but one NA is enough for me, I don't need 200.


I get that, but MT were much more melodic/musical/catchier IMO than any of the Boston HC bands of the time (not counting more melodic or post-punky stuff like The Freeze, Proletariat, etc.) except for Brotherhood (the DYS album). Later (much better) YoT stuff like "Disengage" has more in common with Minor Threat than stuff like Break Down the Walls does musically. That was my main point.

I forgot to include Uniform Choice as a heavily Minor Threat-influenced band yeah that was a big influence on all OC SxE, so I'm contradicting myself a bit. That was sort of a bridge between Minor Threat on one side and Gorilla Biscuits and bands like that on the other side.

I only meant pop-punk compared to something like Minor Disturbance or the blur of noise that's Legless Bull. I also prefer Out of Step and especially Salad Days in my old age, as great as their 1st 2 7"s and FYH tracks and the demo are.

I know about the SSD/Dischord connection.

You're insane re: NA being overrated. I didn't hear most of those early to mid '00s NA clones as I was knee deep in indie rock then (it was fantastic). It sounds like I didn't miss much.
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