Dum Dum Girls vs Vice Squad

[clash77]

....

[JGJR]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

[77clash]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

You are in the minority. Stand Strong Stand Proud was ground breaking to have a female singer fronting a UK82 band.

[dave123]

I am a big fan of the early Vice Squad stuff as well, but I haven't heard any of the non-BB stuff. I will attempt to change that situation. Where do you start with the Dum Dum Girls? I never even bothered looking into that band because of the name. I thought it was some cliche indy rock or something equally as hard to take. Tell me where to start, and I will give them a listen.

[JGJR]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

You are in the minority. Stand Strong Stand Proud was ground breaking to have a female singer fronting a UK82 band.

True, but far from ground-breaking for UK punk (or post-punk) in general. See also: Penetration, The Slits, The Raincoats, Au Pairs, the early Banshees, et al. If I'm being honest and especially if Shot Away is taken out of the equation, like all of those bands more than Vice Squad.

[JGJR]

I am a big fan of the early Vice Squad stuff as well, but I haven't heard any of the non-BB stuff. I will attempt to change that situation. Where do you start with the Dum Dum Girls? I never even bothered looking into that band because of the name. I thought it was some cliche indy rock or something equally as hard to take. Tell me where to start, and I will give them a listen.

It depends on what your tastes are. If you want to start off with the more produced, new wave/goth type stuff, check out the most recent album Too True or the 2012 EP End of Daze. 2011's Only in Dreams is her only record with her live band backing her (she's essentially a one-woman band, though Sune from The Raveonettes has played on almost all of her records since 2011's "He Gets Me High" EP, which is a good test to see if they are for you and it may be my favorite release of hers; great Smiths cover on it) and has a Pretenders-esque feel to it. The earlier stuff (the best of which is I Will Be, her debut album) is really catchy, stripped-down garage rock with surf style guitar in spots, but you have to have a tolerance for production values that makes early 7 Seconds sound like David Gilmour-led Pink Floyd. There's nothing "cliche" about it. It's just really good songs with a great singer, but one who changes styles (slightly) with each release.

[lewdd]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

You are in the minority. Stand Strong Stand Proud was ground breaking to have a female singer fronting a UK82 band.

True, but far from ground-breaking for UK punk (or post-punk) in general. See also: Penetration, The Slits, The Raincoats, Au Pairs, the early Banshees, et al. If I'm being honest and especially if Shot Away is taken out of the equation, like all of those bands more than Vice Squad.

You don't like punk rock.

[JGJR]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

You are in the minority. Stand Strong Stand Proud was ground breaking to have a female singer fronting a UK82 band.

True, but far from ground-breaking for UK punk (or post-punk) in general. See also: Penetration, The Slits, The Raincoats, Au Pairs, the early Banshees, et al. If I'm being honest and especially if Shot Away is taken out of the equation, like all of those bands more than Vice Squad.

You don't like punk rock.

It's not that, but as far as the UK stuff goes I just generally prefer the original '76-'81 stuff to the UK82 or later stuff with some notable exceptions.

[dave123]

I am a big fan of the early Vice Squad stuff as well, but I haven't heard any of the non-BB stuff. I will attempt to change that situation. Where do you start with the Dum Dum Girls? I never even bothered looking into that band because of the name. I thought it was some cliche indy rock or something equally as hard to take. Tell me where to start, and I will give them a listen.

It depends on what your tastes are. If you want to start off with the more produced, new wave/goth type stuff, check out the most recent album Too True or the 2012 EP End of Daze. 2011's Only in Dreams is her only record with her live band backing her (she's essentially a one-woman band, though Sune from The Raveonettes has played on almost all of her records since 2011's "He Gets Me High" EP, which is a good test to see if they are for you and it may be my favorite release of hers; great Smiths cover on it) and has a Pretenders-esque feel to it. The earlier stuff (the best of which is I Will Be, her debut album) is really catchy, stripped-down garage rock with surf style guitar in spots, but you have to have a tolerance for production values that makes early 7 Seconds sound like David Gilmour-led Pink Floyd. There's nothing "cliche" about it. It's just really good songs with a great singer, but one who changes styles (slightly) with each release.

Thanks for the info. I will start with "He Gets Me High" and let you know. I am always stoked to find out something that I had written off for no good reason is actually good.

[Welly]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

You are in the minority. Stand Strong Stand Proud was ground breaking to have a female singer fronting a UK82 band.

True, but far from ground-breaking for UK punk (or post-punk) in general. See also: Penetration, The Slits, The Raincoats, Au Pairs, the early Banshees, et al. If I'm being honest and especially if Shot Away is taken out of the equation, like all of those bands more than Vice Squad.

You don't like punk rock.

It's not that, but as far as the UK stuff goes I just generally prefer the original '76-'81 stuff to the UK82 or later stuff with some notable exceptions.

Nah, you just wanted to one-up his post.

[JGJR]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

You are in the minority. Stand Strong Stand Proud was ground breaking to have a female singer fronting a UK82 band.

True, but far from ground-breaking for UK punk (or post-punk) in general. See also: Penetration, The Slits, The Raincoats, Au Pairs, the early Banshees, et al. If I'm being honest and especially if Shot Away is taken out of the equation, like all of those bands more than Vice Squad.

You don't like punk rock.

It's not that, but as far as the UK stuff goes I just generally prefer the original '76-'81 stuff to the UK82 or later stuff with some notable exceptions.

Nah, you just wanted to one-up his post.

Guilty as charged, your honor, though I do generally and genuinely prefer the '76-'81 stuff.

[Welly]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

You are in the minority. Stand Strong Stand Proud was ground breaking to have a female singer fronting a UK82 band.

True, but far from ground-breaking for UK punk (or post-punk) in general. See also: Penetration, The Slits, The Raincoats, Au Pairs, the early Banshees, et al. If I'm being honest and especially if Shot Away is taken out of the equation, like all of those bands more than Vice Squad.

You don't like punk rock.

It's not that, but as far as the UK stuff goes I just generally prefer the original '76-'81 stuff to the UK82 or later stuff with some notable exceptions.

Nah, you just wanted to one-up his post.

Guilty as charged, your honor, though I do generally and genuinely prefer the '76-'81 stuff.

Definitely. And Vice Squad were fucking atrocious.

[JGJR]

I am a big fan of the early Vice Squad stuff as well, but I haven't heard any of the non-BB stuff. I will attempt to change that situation. Where do you start with the Dum Dum Girls? I never even bothered looking into that band because of the name. I thought it was some cliche indy rock or something equally as hard to take. Tell me where to start, and I will give them a listen.

It depends on what your tastes are. If you want to start off with the more produced, new wave/goth type stuff, check out the most recent album Too True or the 2012 EP End of Daze. 2011's Only in Dreams is her only record with her live band backing her (she's essentially a one-woman band, though Sune from The Raveonettes has played on almost all of her records since 2011's "He Gets Me High" EP, which is a good test to see if they are for you and it may be my favorite release of hers; great Smiths cover on it) and has a Pretenders-esque feel to it. The earlier stuff (the best of which is I Will Be, her debut album) is really catchy, stripped-down garage rock with surf style guitar in spots, but you have to have a tolerance for production values that makes early 7 Seconds sound like David Gilmour-led Pink Floyd. There's nothing "cliche" about it. It's just really good songs with a great singer, but one who changes styles (slightly) with each release.

Thanks for the info. I will start with "He Gets Me High" and let you know. I am always stoked to find out something that I had written off for no good reason is actually good.

Very curious what you'll think. They are a very special band to me because I've gotten to interview Dee Dee twice (including once for the cover story of the most recent issue of The Big Takeover). And I'm really curious what you'll think of that Vice Squad record, too. If you search for both of them, you'll find 'em on the YouTube (though just individual tracks for the VS).

[JGJR]

Definitely. And Vice Squad were fucking atrocious.

I'm a bit surprised you don't dig 'em, but they seem to have their detractors for sure both here and in the UK. Have you ever heard Shot Away, though? Otherwise, we reach.

[Welly]

Definitely. And Vice Squad were fucking atrocious.

I'm a bit surprised you don't dig 'em, but they seem to have their detractors for sure both here and in the UK. Have you ever heard Shot Away, though? Otherwise, we reach.

Not heard that, and I have no reason to ever, thanks.

Vice Squad - the epitome of dull UK 80's damp grey council estate plodding punk boredom.

Believe me, UK 80's damp grey council estates weren't very exciting.

But that's probably why the Kennedys, Flag, Threat and Jerks seemed a lot more so.

[JGJR]

Definitely. And Vice Squad were fucking atrocious.

I'm a bit surprised you don't dig 'em, but they seem to have their detractors for sure both here and in the UK. Have you ever heard Shot Away, though? Otherwise, we reach.

Not heard that, and I have no reason to ever, thanks.

Vice Squad - the epitome of dull UK 80's damp grey council estate plodding punk boredom.

Believe me, UK 80's damp grey council estates weren't very exciting.

But that's probably why the Kennedys, Flag, Threat and Jerks seemed a lot more so.

Gotcha. I'm a Yank, so while I believe you and see no reason to disagree, even '80s damp grey council estate music from the UK had appeal to me as a kid. Of course, I loved and still love DKs, Flag, Minor Threat (the 3 bands that had the most influence as far as getting me into hardcore), Circle Jerks, et al, too.

[Welly]

Gotcha. I'm a Yank, so while I believe you and see no reason to disagree, even '80s damp grey council estate music from the UK had appeal to me as a kid.

I like plenty of UK stuff of that era, but that kind of dull plod did nothing for me. There was a glut of that shit.

[lewdd]

Gotcha. I'm a Yank, so while I believe you and see no reason to disagree, even '80s damp grey council estate music from the UK had appeal to me as a kid.

I like plenty of UK stuff of that era, but that kind of dull plod did nothing for me. There was a glut of that shit.

Surely, you would listen to the Vice Squad before the Dum Dum Girls though.

[Welly]

Gotcha. I'm a Yank, so while I believe you and see no reason to disagree, even '80s damp grey council estate music from the UK had appeal to me as a kid.

I like plenty of UK stuff of that era, but that kind of dull plod did nothing for me. There was a glut of that shit.

Surely, you would listen to the Vice Squad before the Dum Dum Girls though.

No idea. Never heard Dum Dum Girls.

[dave123]

I am a big fan of the early Vice Squad stuff as well, but I haven't heard any of the non-BB stuff. I will attempt to change that situation. Where do you start with the Dum Dum Girls? I never even bothered looking into that band because of the name. I thought it was some cliche indy rock or something equally as hard to take. Tell me where to start, and I will give them a listen.

It depends on what your tastes are. If you want to start off with the more produced, new wave/goth type stuff, check out the most recent album Too True or the 2012 EP End of Daze. 2011's Only in Dreams is her only record with her live band backing her (she's essentially a one-woman band, though Sune from The Raveonettes has played on almost all of her records since 2011's "He Gets Me High" EP, which is a good test to see if they are for you and it may be my favorite release of hers; great Smiths cover on it) and has a Pretenders-esque feel to it. The earlier stuff (the best of which is I Will Be, her debut album) is really catchy, stripped-down garage rock with surf style guitar in spots, but you have to have a tolerance for production values that makes early 7 Seconds sound like David Gilmour-led Pink Floyd. There's nothing "cliche" about it. It's just really good songs with a great singer, but one who changes styles (slightly) with each release.

Thanks for the info. I will start with "He Gets Me High" and let you know. I am always stoked to find out something that I had written off for no good reason is actually good.

Finally had a moment to check out the Dum Dum Girls. I really like both versions/eras. I was worried when you mentioned the Pretenders (I am not a fan), but I get the comparison and liked that stuff anyway. The jangly poppier stuff is kind of like a cross between early Bangles and Siouxie and the Banshees. I would recommend it to anyone into the Go-gos or the Bangles (which I am on both accounts). The gothy/new wave stuff is a whole different kettle of fish. Equally as good but a very different vibe. Dark while still maintaining much of the melody. You are right, nothing cliche. I like how they don't smile when playing. Thanks for recommending.

Very curious what you'll think. They are a very special band to me because I've gotten to interview Dee Dee twice (including once for the cover story of the most recent issue of The Big Takeover). And I'm really curious what you'll think of that Vice Squad record, too. If you search for both of them, you'll find 'em on the YouTube (though just individual tracks for the VS).

[clash77]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

Silly comparison maybe?..The hype surrounding the DDG is laughable to me..But as usuall, thats my opinion..

[gregpolard]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

Silly comparison maybe?..The hype surrounding the DDG is laughable to me..But as usuall, thats my opinion..

Maybe I'm not looking in the right place but I don't really think DDG are hyped at all. Aside from JGJR frequently professing his love for them on here. PS they're a good band.

[JGJR]

Finally had a moment to check out the Dum Dum Girls. I really like both versions/eras. I was worried when you mentioned the Pretenders (I am not a fan), but I get the comparison and liked that stuff anyway. The jangly poppier stuff is kind of like a cross between early Bangles and Siouxie and the Banshees. I would recommend it to anyone into the Go-gos or the Bangles (which I am on both accounts). The gothy/new wave stuff is a whole different kettle of fish. Equally as good but a very different vibe. Dark while still maintaining much of the melody. You are right, nothing cliche. I like how they don't smile when playing. Thanks for recommending.

I'm really glad you liked them, but it sounds like you didn't check out the 1st 12" or I Will Be (the debut Lp). Only in Dreams and to a lesser extent "He Gets Me High" are definitely like The Go-Gos/Bangles (early), especially the former in places on Only in Dreams. I think it's a very logical progression to the more goth stuff, though, especially if you go from her very earliest recordings as DDG.

[JGJR]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

Silly comparison maybe?..The hype surrounding the DDG is laughable to me..But as usuall, thats my opinion..

Maybe I'm not looking in the right place but I don't really think DDG are hyped at all. Aside from JGJR frequently professing his love for them on here. PS they're a good band.

Yep. Plus, have you actually ever heard a DDG song, clash77, or are you just dismissing them out of hand?

[lewdd]

I couldn't do without my copies of Shot Away or the entire DDG catalog, but carry on. What a silly comparison (though I think Dee Dee would love the goth/new wave vibe of Shot Away, too, if she doesn't already know that record). And yeah, I like the earlier stuff with Beki Bondage, too, but I'm probably in the small minority who thinks Shot Away is their best record by some distance.

Silly comparison maybe?..The hype surrounding the DDG is laughable to me..But as usuall, thats my opinion..

Maybe I'm not looking in the right place but I don't really think DDG are hyped at all. Aside from JGJR frequently professing his love for them on here. PS they're a good band.

Yep. Plus, have you actually ever heard a DDG song, clash77, or are you just dismissing them out of hand?

I dismissed them because I have liked about 1% of most of the new bands people on here have raved about.

[dave123]

Finally had a moment to check out the Dum Dum Girls. I really like both versions/eras. I was worried when you mentioned the Pretenders (I am not a fan), but I get the comparison and liked that stuff anyway. The jangly poppier stuff is kind of like a cross between early Bangles and Siouxie and the Banshees. I would recommend it to anyone into the Go-gos or the Bangles (which I am on both accounts). The gothy/new wave stuff is a whole different kettle of fish. Equally as good but a very different vibe. Dark while still maintaining much of the melody. You are right, nothing cliche. I like how they don't smile when playing. Thanks for recommending.

I'm really glad you liked them, but it sounds like you didn't check out the 1st 12" or I Will Be (the debut Lp). Only in Dreams and to a lesser extent "He Gets Me High" are definitely like The Go-Gos/Bangles (early), especially the former in places on Only in Dreams. I think it's a very logical progression to the more goth stuff, though, especially if you go from her very earliest recordings as DDG.

You're right. I haven't had a chance to check out a full LP yet. I just hit up a few songs here and there the other night. When I get a decent amount of time to really listen, I will start at the beginning.

[dave123]

Finally had a moment to check out the Dum Dum Girls. I really like both versions/eras. I was worried when you mentioned the Pretenders (I am not a fan), but I get the comparison and liked that stuff anyway. The jangly poppier stuff is kind of like a cross between early Bangles and Siouxie and the Banshees. I would recommend it to anyone into the Go-gos or the Bangles (which I am on both accounts). The gothy/new wave stuff is a whole different kettle of fish. Equally as good but a very different vibe. Dark while still maintaining much of the melody. You are right, nothing cliche. I like how they don't smile when playing. Thanks for recommending.

I'm really glad you liked them, but it sounds like you didn't check out the 1st 12" or I Will Be (the debut Lp). Only in Dreams and to a lesser extent "He Gets Me High" are definitely like The Go-Gos/Bangles (early), especially the former in places on Only in Dreams. I think it's a very logical progression to the more goth stuff, though, especially if you go from her very earliest recordings as DDG.

You're right. I haven't had a chance to check out a full LP yet. I just hit up a few songs here and there the other night. When I get a decent amount of time to really listen, I will start at the beginning.

I had a moment to check out I Will Be and most of Only in Dreams. I like Only in Dreams a little more. It is definitely more slick. I still liked I Will Be, but it is more raw and not as straight up melodic. Sort of an underlying dark side. I am going to seek out copies for myself, as I can't get super into anything from a Youtube listen.

[JGJR]

I had a moment to check out I Will Be and most of Only in Dreams. I like Only in Dreams a little more. It is definitely more slick. I still liked I Will Be, but it is more raw and not as straight up melodic. Sort of an underlying dark side. I am going to seek out copies for myself, as I can't get super into anything from a Youtube listen.

They're both easy to find as they're on Sub Pop, still in print, etc. unless you're looking for an original pressing of I Will Be on HoZac. That one has eluded me, unfortunately, but I am OK with my Sub Pop copy.