dave123 wrote:JGJR wrote:dave123 wrote:JGJR wrote:dave123 wrote:captain2man wrote: A switched flipped and then they produced a masterpiece in 'Hello Bastards'.
I am still a big fan of their early output, but I couldn't agree more about the "switch flipping" and Hello Bastards being a masterpiece.
This basically except I actually love the 1st 7" but not Background (the remix from a few years ago is way better). And I think Tinnitus is where the switch really flipped as it was the first thing they recorded with their still intact lineup.
Good point. Isae aldy beau soleil is a ripper of a song. They were/are such a cool band all the way around. Dag Nasty had the '80s but Lifetime had the '90s. Anyone at the Detroit fest in the '90s where Lifetime played. There were kids literally crying.
Yeah, "Isae Aldy Beausoleil" has been (by far) my favorite Lifetime song since I first heard it 20 years ago after picking up the 7" at a Handy St show (pretty certain of this). I am biased since Ari and Dave P are old friends, but that's a great record/band regardless, of course. It's still odd that Lifetime generated that kind of reaction later on, though. I'll always think of them as one of many great local NJ bands at that time.
When Hello Bastards hit, I don't think anyone knew the influence it would have, including the band. They were still playing to their old audience (ie. the hardcore scene) for the most part, which was somewhat hot and cold on the band depending on where you were. I caught one of their reunion shows at the Fest (in fact, seeing Lifetime again was the only reason I volunteered to help that year), and it was cool. Not quite the same, as the audience was different (ie. not just hardcore kids and no one was crying), but still really good. Dan is an awesome dude that always takes the time to say hello. The last time I saw him we talked Dillinger 4 and Billingsgate on the street. Nice.
xxxMidgexxx wrote:But perhaps I just love drone stuff in general.
matt wrote:A+
The Snake wrote:...I think that YOT had much bigger impact than SSD.
scannest wrote:It's like a filmmaker saying "Spielberg is my idol. Every time I get behind the camera I think about how I can make my film as good as Hook"
version sound wrote:The Snake wrote:...I think that YOT had much bigger impact than SSD.
That's like saying that Green Day had more impact than The Clash. Sorry, but there would have been no youth crew without the Boston Crew. There's your impact. SSD and their buddies started all that shit, for good or ill. So, no SSD means no YOT as you know them. It's easy to walk the path when someone has already cleared it for you.
version sound wrote:The Snake wrote:...I think that YOT had much bigger impact than SSD.
That's like saying that Green Day had more impact than The Clash. Sorry, but there would have been no youth crew without the Boston Crew. There's your impact. SSD and their buddies started all that shit, for good or ill. So, no SSD means no YOT as you know them. It's easy to walk the path when someone has already cleared it for you.
The Snake wrote:When I said that YOT had more impact, I meant that they inspired more people to get involve with hardcore punk or straight edge than SSD, that is just the fact. YOT pretty much started from scratch and when they started there were no straight edge hardcore in NYC (and not just NYC) and what they help to build after that had big impact on million kids all over the world. But that is just my opinion.
Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:When I said that YOT had more impact, I meant that they inspired more people to get involve with hardcore punk or straight edge than SSD, that is just the fact. YOT pretty much started from scratch and when they started there were no straight edge hardcore in NYC (and not just NYC) and what they help to build after that had big impact on million kids all over the world. But that is just my opinion.
So, do you think it's a good thing that they fucked it all up then?
version sound wrote:They didn't start from scratch, because it had all been done before. Plus, weren't they from Connecticut? I was around at the time, and all that youth crew shit seemed completely regressive to me. I was way more interested in bands that were trying to do something new rather than the ones who wanted to take hardcore back to 1982.
version sound wrote:They didn't start from scratch, because it had all been done before. Plus, weren't they from Connecticut? I was around at the time, and all that youth crew shit seemed completely regressive to me. I was way more interested in bands that were trying to do something new rather than the ones who wanted to take hardcore back to 1982.
The Snake wrote:version sound wrote:They didn't start from scratch, because it had all been done before. Plus, weren't they from Connecticut? I was around at the time, and all that youth crew shit seemed completely regressive to me. I was way more interested in bands that were trying to do something new rather than the ones who wanted to take hardcore back to 1982.
I hope that by something new, you dont think bad crossover metal records.
version sound wrote:The only Youth Crew record I ever owned in the '80s was the Crippled Youth EP. I liked that. I had no time for the REV stuff. I've listened to some of it since, and it's not bad, but it doesn't mean anything to me. There was definitely a whole different vibe to that stuff and the stuff that came out in '81/'82. For one thing, there was a hardcore formula by the late '80s, so the chance of anyone doing anything interesting was pretty slim.
The Snake wrote:Welly, now you are making fun of me, ha ha!
Of course, there were some great bands and records in mid to late 80s that did not fit in some boring hardcore punk stereotypes, but why dis all youth crew hardcore bands from that period.
The Snake wrote:I hope that by something new, you dont think bad crossover metal records.
version sound wrote:The Snake wrote:I hope that by something new, you dont think bad crossover metal records.
The Snake wrote:Of course, there were some great bands and records in mid to late 80s that did not fit in some boring hardcore punk stereotypes, but why dis all youth crew hardcore bands from that period.
version sound wrote:Nothing personal. Greg is one of my favorite posters, and he's a youth crew baby. All that stuff that took hardcore and made it look like a team sport just rubbed me the wrong way. Even SSD in their letterman jackets were a turn off. I played team sports. I enjoyed playing, but I wasn't a fan of all the bullshit that went along with it, so I quit. I certainly didn't want to see hardcore bands that looked like the jocks in my high school. Most of those guys were actually nice, maybe because I grew up with them, but they were meatheads. I prefer to keep the meatheads out of hardcore.
Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:Welly, now you are making fun of me, ha ha!
Of course, there were some great bands and records in mid to late 80s that did not fit in some boring hardcore punk stereotypes, but why dis all youth crew hardcore bands from that period.
Because they were shit?
version sound wrote:The Snake wrote:Of course, there were some great bands and records in mid to late 80s that did not fit in some boring hardcore punk stereotypes, but why dis all youth crew hardcore bands from that period.
Nothing personal. Greg is one of my favorite posters, and he's a youth crew baby. All that stuff that took hardcore and made it look like a team sport just rubbed me the wrong way. Even SSD in their letterman jackets were a turn off. I played team sports. I enjoyed playing, but I wasn't a fan of all the bullshit that went along with it, so I quit. I certainly didn't want to see hardcore bands that looked like the jocks in my high school. Most of those guys were actually nice, maybe because I grew up with them, but they were meatheads. I prefer to keep the meatheads out of hardcore.
Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:version sound wrote:They didn't start from scratch, because it had all been done before. Plus, weren't they from Connecticut? I was around at the time, and all that youth crew shit seemed completely regressive to me. I was way more interested in bands that were trying to do something new rather than the ones who wanted to take hardcore back to 1982.
I hope that by something new, you dont think bad crossover metal records.
Yeah, VS got into laying down some funky jams with his long curly locks and Doc Martens.
He did a stint on the mic for TICKLE ME EMO. They had an album out on Interscope in 1989 called 'Eat My Shorts'.
They later progressed to grunge with their 1991 sophomore effort 'Angst In My Pants'.
xxxMidgexxx wrote:But perhaps I just love drone stuff in general.
The Snake wrote:Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:Welly, now you are making fun of me, ha ha!
Of course, there were some great bands and records in mid to late 80s that did not fit in some boring hardcore punk stereotypes, but why dis all youth crew hardcore bands from that period.
Because they were shit?
STRAIGHT AHEAD, TURNING POINT, CHAIN OF STRENGTH... I call it good hardcore.
JGJR wrote:Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:version sound wrote:They didn't start from scratch, because it had all been done before. Plus, weren't they from Connecticut? I was around at the time, and all that youth crew shit seemed completely regressive to me. I was way more interested in bands that were trying to do something new rather than the ones who wanted to take hardcore back to 1982.
I hope that by something new, you dont think bad crossover metal records.
Yeah, VS got into laying down some funky jams with his long curly locks and Doc Martens.
He did a stint on the mic for TICKLE ME EMO. They had an album out on Interscope in 1989 called 'Eat My Shorts'.
They later progressed to grunge with their 1991 sophomore effort 'Angst In My Pants'.
And then Sparks sued them out of existence for taking the title of one of their albums (one of my favorites of theirs, actually).
Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:Welly, now you are making fun of me, ha ha!
Of course, there were some great bands and records in mid to late 80s that did not fit in some boring hardcore punk stereotypes, but why dis all youth crew hardcore bands from that period.
Because they were shit?
STRAIGHT AHEAD, TURNING POINT, CHAIN OF STRENGTH... I call it good hardcore.
I can tell.
You can't take a joke.
Back in the day man, I was too busy sat in my room dressed in black with my black spiky hair, worrying about animals, parents, school, racism, sexism, war, government, bands going metal, and the cops. And I definitely didn't like sports.
The Snake wrote:...plus the war was still fresh here...
The Snake wrote:Actually, I can appreciate good British humor and we Balkans are not so uptight.
I was also in the 90s busy with stuff you mentioned (plus the war was still fresh here) but that did not stop me to like good youth crew hardcore.
Welly wrote:JGJR wrote:Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:version sound wrote:They didn't start from scratch, because it had all been done before. Plus, weren't they from Connecticut? I was around at the time, and all that youth crew shit seemed completely regressive to me. I was way more interested in bands that were trying to do something new rather than the ones who wanted to take hardcore back to 1982.
I hope that by something new, you dont think bad crossover metal records.
Yeah, VS got into laying down some funky jams with his long curly locks and Doc Martens.
He did a stint on the mic for TICKLE ME EMO. They had an album out on Interscope in 1989 called 'Eat My Shorts'.
They later progressed to grunge with their 1991 sophomore effort 'Angst In My Pants'.
And then Sparks sued them out of existence for taking the title of one of their albums (one of my favorites of theirs, actually).
If one of those titles actually got used, then congratulations to whoever that was.
xxxMidgexxx wrote:But perhaps I just love drone stuff in general.
version sound wrote:Yeah YoT "reached more people", but what the hell does that have to do with the quality of the music?
FlexMyHead wrote:My two cents..... I don't own a single SSD record but I own several YoT records. I "get" that YoT most likely doesn't exist if SSD hadn't come before them, but that doesn't mean "earlier is better or earlier has more influence". It's a term used mainly in literature, but using a historical lens is tough for music, it's hard to look at peers and what was going on in other places and then say one was better. It's like comparing Jordan and Lebron or Kobe. What is the point? Each had their place in time/history. When YoT was around, they toured (and not just the USA) and had a MUCH larger impact, kids from all over the world SAW them play, not just heard them. I saw them in fucking Belguim in 1989, they played in small venues all over Europe. They just didn't hit the bigger rock clubs, but played many alternative places. I don't even know if SSD toured the USA? Without a doubt YoT brought their music to more people and did more to expose the world to alternative music. YoT used to talk about SSD and wore their shirts etc and I'm sure YoT turned on people to SSD that might not have ever gave them a listen.
I guess I should check SSD out again, but when I heard the one with the SSD in silver letters on a road (or something) it sounded like cheese-rock. I have no clue what the lyrics were about. YoT might be "by the numbers" hardcore, but at least the lyrics were positive. Not sure what else SSD members went on to do, but YoT members have stayed productive in music, I mean just Walter went on to do Quicksand, Rival Schools, Gorllia Biscuits etc all of which made an impact and have fans to this day. Ray and Porcell have done various styles at various labels. I could careless if they are sXe or if Shelter "sold out".
Yeah, SSD might have blazed the trail, but it ended in lame mullet-rock solos.
FlexMyHead wrote:I know, your ears work better than mine, so talking about which is better is pointless.
Welly wrote:version sound wrote:They didn't start from scratch, because it had all been done before. Plus, weren't they from Connecticut? I was around at the time, and all that youth crew shit seemed completely regressive to me. I was way more interested in bands that were trying to do something new rather than the ones who wanted to take hardcore back to 1982.
Thing is though, those bands who 'wanted to take hardcore back to 1982' at that time, weren't. It was a different thing. I picked up some of those 7"s when they came out, one spin, got rid. Hardcore heavy metal. Different music, same name.
scannest wrote:It's like a filmmaker saying "Spielberg is my idol. Every time I get behind the camera I think about how I can make my film as good as Hook"
Welly wrote:The Snake wrote:Welly, now you are making fun of me, ha ha!
Of course, there were some great bands and records in mid to late 80s that did not fit in some boring hardcore punk stereotypes, but why dis all youth crew hardcore bands from that period.
Because they were shit?
FlexMyHead wrote:My two cents..... I don't own a single SSD record but I own several YoT records. I "get" that YoT most likely doesn't exist if SSD hadn't come before them, but that doesn't mean "earlier is better or earlier has more influence". It's a term used mainly in literature, but using a historical lens is tough for music, it's hard to look at peers and what was going on in other places and then say one was better. It's like comparing Jordan and Lebron or Kobe. What is the point? Each had their place in time/history. When YoT was around, they toured (and not just the USA) and had a MUCH larger impact, kids from all over the world SAW them play, not just heard them. I saw them in fucking Belguim in 1989, they played in small venues all over Europe. They just didn't hit the bigger rock clubs, but played many alternative places. I don't even know if SSD toured the USA? Without a doubt YoT brought their music to more people and did more to expose the world to alternative music. YoT used to talk about SSD and wore their shirts etc and I'm sure YoT turned on people to SSD that might not have ever gave them a listen.
I guess I should check SSD out again, but when I heard the one with the SSD in silver letters on a road (or something) it sounded like cheese-rock. I have no clue what the lyrics were about. YoT might be "by the numbers" hardcore, but at least the lyrics were positive. Not sure what else SSD members went on to do, but YoT members have stayed productive in music, I mean just Walter went on to do Quicksand, Rival Schools, Gorllia Biscuits etc all of which made an impact and have fans to this day. Ray and Porcell have done various styles at various labels. I could careless if they are sXe or if Shelter "sold out".
Yeah, SSD might have blazed the trail, but it ended in lame mullet-rock solos.
Gary wrote:I love both bands,don't care who had more impact.
FlexMyHead wrote:I could careless
The Snake wrote:Also, I don´t think that YOT music was regressive and that sounded like 82 hardcore.
YOT is nothing like White Cross for example.
At least in 1985. YOT was one of the rare bands in USA that played stripped down raw hardcore punk.
There are more bands now that sound like it is 82 then in the second part of the 80´s.
dave123 wrote:The Snake wrote:Also, I don´t think that YOT music was regressive and that sounded like 82 hardcore.
YOT is nothing like White Cross for example.
At least in 1985. YOT was one of the rare bands in USA that played stripped down raw hardcore punk.
There are more bands now that sound like it is 82 then in the second part of the 80´s.
I think I get what you are saying. However, YOT described themselves as regressive and were attempting to recapture the sound and energy of bands such as Negative Approach, SSD, etc., as most of those bands had moved on to some other musical form or broken up. On the other hand, I don't think their music went all the way back to the raw sound from '82. The influences were there, but YOT was way too unique in their own right to be a blatant rehash of the early '80s. You are right about their being a lot of current bands describing their sound as early '80s (or at least mid '80s), and a lot of them are really good... Violent Reaction, the Flex, Boston Strangler, Prisoner Abuse, etc.
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