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Fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion, though I don't think Discharge and the Exploited have much in common other than being from the UK.

version sound wrote:Fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion, though I don't think Discharge and the Exploited have much in common other than being from the UK.

I'm with stabb!

I don't get how Discharge have anything to do with the Exploited, but the older geezers who saw them play the youth centre in my town in '81 said they were crap live... and weren't half the lyrics were from anti-nuclear leaflets? It was all about the zeitgeist and they captured it well. Hence the influence on others. Like it or not, Discharge influenced a lot of those old classic U.S. hardcore records. I think people forget how early they did the over the top stuff. Also see the Bristol bands for similar global influence.

JGJR wrote:I have never owned a physical copy of HNSNSN or any Discharge record. I have heard it, however, though admittedly in more recent years (I knew a few songs before that just via tape trading and stuff). Had I heard it in '82 like you did or when I first got into punk, I might feel differently. I just prefer other bands. That is all.

I am constantly amazed at the conviction of judgment made based upon virtually nothing. You've heard it, but clearly not much, but I guess you've always been able to judge the true worth of a band/record after one or two cursory listens. I guess you've never had the experience of discovering how great something is only after repeated listens.

version sound wrote:

JGJR wrote:I have never owned a physical copy of HNSNSN or any Discharge record. I have heard it, however, though admittedly in more recent years (I knew a few songs before that just via tape trading and stuff). Had I heard it in '82 like you did or when I first got into punk, I might feel differently. I just prefer other bands. That is all.

I am constantly amazed at the conviction of judgment made based upon virtually nothing. You've heard it, but clearly not much, but I guess you've always been able to judge the true worth of a band/record after one or two cursory listens. I guess you've never had the experience of discovering how great something is only after repeated listens.

Obviously I have, but they have just never grabbed me. Can we move on please? I'm not saying I won't think they're amazing at some point and finally "get it" (it has happened) but at this point of my life, nah.

Anyone ever listened to Recharge? A buddy of mine sang for them. Good stuff. They disappeared. Then he disappeared. Oh, the punx...

http://www.recharge.de/

Discharge>GBH>_______________________________________________>Exploited

Michele wrote:Discharge>GBH>_______________________________________________>Exploited

Ding! That is the correct answer Michele.

Welly wrote:

Michele wrote:Discharge>GBH>_______________________________________________>Exploited

Ding! That is the correct answer Michele.

I'd say it's more like Discharge >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GBH. Hell, I might even put Exploited LPs number 2 and 3 ahead of GBH.

Discharge >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GBH >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Exploited

Then you guys have obviously not listened to GBH enough repeated times to discover how great they are.

I like GBH. I just like Discharge a whole lot more.

version sound wrote:I like GBH. I just like Discharge a whole lot more.

That's because Discharge are a whole lot better.


(I like GBH too)

Discover the greatness or gtfo.

Gary wrote:

version sound wrote:I like GBH. I just like Discharge a whole lot more.

That's because Discharge are a whole lot better.


(I like GBH too)

t's it easy as it is coming to my opinion

I'm with JGJR except there will not be a time in my life when I'll think "Wow, I really misjudged Discharge. They're the Punk cat's pajamas " I've heard old Discharge, mid-period Discharge & the Motley Discharge recordings. They "do nothing, say nothing, and I hear nothing" for me. And the Exploited comparison was just about generic lyrics which that early recording has.

GBH, on the other hand, aren't too bad. Hell, I'd rather listen to Vice Squad over the choice of a bloody Discharge record. I just don't get why anyone could get that worked up over that group.

Again, you're entitled to your opinion. There are plenty of bands/records that people get jazzed about around here that do nothing for me. My beef (if it even amounts to that), is that JGJR has a habit of making pronouncements about bands and records he isn't really familiar with. There is a difference between "I wasn't that into what I heard" and "THIS BAND IS SO OVERRATED!!" I wasn't that into what I heard by ALL, but I don't chime in on the endless ALL threads about how overrated they are, because I haven't really heard enough to rate them.

john stabb wrote:I'm with JGJR except there will not be a time in my life when I'll think "Wow, I really misjudged Discharge. They're the Punk cat's pajamas " I've heard old Discharge, mid-period Discharge & the Motley Discharge recordings. They "do nothing, say nothing, and I hear nothing" for me. And the Exploited comparison was just about generic lyrics which that early recording has.

GBH, on the other hand, aren't too bad. Hell, I'd rather listen to Vice Squad over the choice of a bloody Discharge record. I just don't get why anyone could get that worked up over that group.

Right on. I'd rather listen to Vice Squad's Shot Away (which is a great album) than anything else discussed in this thread.

version sound wrote:Again, you're entitled to your opinion. There are plenty of bands/records that people get jazzed about around here that do nothing for me. My beef (if it even amounts to that), is that JGJR has a habit of making pronouncements about bands and records he isn't really familiar with. There is a difference between "I wasn't that into what I heard" and "THIS BAND IS SO OVERRATED!!" I wasn't that into what I heard by ALL, but I don't chime in on the endless ALL threads about how overrated they are, because I haven't really heard enough to rate them.

Perhaps that's true and I misspoke and exaggerated for effect (I do that because, well let's face it, this is a message board and we all like to make pronouncements like that from time to time; I'm far from the only offender here). Nevertheless, I'll make you a deal. At some point in the next few days, I will (if I have a chance) sit down and listen to HNSNSN and get back to you. I have heard it and some of their other earlier material, so I'm not just judging by a few songs. But perhaps it is time for a reappraisal given their general reputation around here and in general. M'kay?

Deal.

JGJR - Listen to 'Why?' first ('Ain't No Feeble Bastard"), then move to the album. I first heard 'Why?' when I was 12-13 in 81-82. I remember hearing what sounded like an air raid and looking at the cover and feeling sick. I was introduced to 'Penis Envy' by Crass at the same time and the experience was the same.

I always advocate listening in order, so I'll second that. Just be sure to follow up with HNSNSN. Why is the blueprint for most of the Dis bands. It's great, but HNSNSN is about 10 steps forward IMO. There were only a few bands that even attempted that sound, and even though I like those bands a lot, no one even came close to matching the real thing.

version sound wrote:There were only a few bands that even attempted that sound, and even though I like those bands a lot, no one even came close to matching the real thing.

Two words: Crucifix and Dehumanization.

Welly wrote:

version sound wrote:There were only a few bands that even attempted that sound, and even though I like those bands a lot, no one even came close to matching the real thing.

Two words: Crucifix and Dehumanization.

I love that record, but other than being Peace Punk, I never really associated it with Discharge. Do kids still listen to Crucifix? I kind of feel like they've been forgotten. Proudflesh were pretty awesome too.

version sound wrote:

Welly wrote:

version sound wrote:There were only a few bands that even attempted that sound, and even though I like those bands a lot, no one even came close to matching the real thing.

Two words: Crucifix and Dehumanization.

I love that record, but other than being Peace Punk, I never really associated it with Discharge. Do kids still listen to Crucifix? I kind of feel like they've been forgotten. Proudflesh were pretty awesome too.

i think crucifix has always had a current fanbase amongst crust kids. when i was getting into hc, that first lp was still held in high regard.

version sound wrote:I love that record, but other than being Peace Punk, I never really associated it with Discharge.

Really? I always thought they took HNSNSN into the studio and said "make it sound like that". Is Discharge not 'peace punk'?

version sound wrote:Do kids still listen to Crucifix?

Who cares?

yourenotevil wrote:i think crucifix has always had a current fanbase amongst crust kids. when i was getting into hc, that first lp was still held in high regard.

So you were crust?

Welly wrote:

version sound wrote:I love that record, but other than being Peace Punk, I never really associated it with Discharge.

Really? I always thought they took HNSNSN into the studio and said "make it sound like that". Is Discharge not 'peace punk'?

version sound wrote:Do kids still listen to Crucifix?

Who cares?

Oh yeah, they were both Peace Punk. I always associated Crucifix more with Crass, but maybe I was just focusing on the poster sleeve.

The only Crucifix song I've ever heard is Steel Case Enclosure from Rat Music Vol. 1. Is their other stuff that good? If so, I should check it out.

xxxHunterxxx wrote:The only Crucifix song I've ever heard is Steel Case Enclosure from Rat Music Vol. 1. Is their other stuff that good? If so, I should check it out.

Yes, the album, and then the 7". Well I like 'em anyway.

Welly wrote:

xxxHunterxxx wrote:The only Crucifix song I've ever heard is Steel Case Enclosure from Rat Music Vol. 1. Is their other stuff that good? If so, I should check it out.

Yes, the album, and then the 7". Well I like 'em anyway.

Cool. Listening on YouTube now.

xxxHunterxxx wrote:The only Crucifix song I've ever heard is Steel Case Enclosure from Rat Music Vol. 1. Is their other stuff that good? If so, I should check it out.

I think it's all great. "Steel Case Enclosure" is closer to the stuff on the self-titled 12" than Dehumanization, generally speaking.

version sound wrote:

xxxHunterxxx wrote:The only Crucifix song I've ever heard is Steel Case Enclosure from Rat Music Vol. 1. Is their other stuff that good? If so, I should check it out.

I think it's all great. "Steel Case Enclosure" is closer to the stuff on the self-titled 12" than Dehumanization, generally speaking.

Dehumanization was good but faster than what I was hoping for. I'll check the 12" next.

Welly wrote:

yourenotevil wrote:i think crucifix has always had a current fanbase amongst crust kids. when i was getting into hc, that first lp was still held in high regard.

So you were crust?

the closest i got to crust was not showering for a few days in a row. once i heard the all quiet comp track, i def checked out that album. i didn't get a hold of the other stuff until recently. it is good, but the lp is def their best release.

Does DIsrupt count as a ripoff band? I liked them quite a bit. Although I could do without the constant radical vegetarian visuals of cows being mutilated and the like.

I don't think we can call all crust bands as ripoff bands, even if they for sure follow Discharge's steps...
Weird fact, the crust term was invented by Hellbastard that used to label their sound crusty after they rehearsed with some distortion pedal out of charge....

Honestly, I'm not even sure what defines crust as a musical genre. It can't just be Discharge worship, because that's already pretty well covered by dis-core and d-beat. Anyone have a better handle on it?

Welly wrote:

xxxHunterxxx wrote:The only Crucifix song I've ever heard is Steel Case Enclosure from Rat Music Vol. 1. Is their other stuff that good? If so, I should check it out.

Yes, the album, and then the 7". Well I like 'em anyway.

I second this. Crucifix were great. Dehumanization is their best, but the stuff on Exhibit A is pretty cool, too. It's interesting that at least from my experience, they were a crust/peace-punk associated band that kids not immersed in that scene really liked as well.

And Welly, I sometimes think that Penis Envy is the best Crass album. It is amazing.

People listened to everything in the '80s. The scene wasn't big enough to only listen to straight edge bands or peace punk bands or horror punk bands or whatever.

version sound wrote:Honestly, I'm not even sure what defines crust as a musical genre. It can't just be Discharge worship, because that's already pretty well covered by dis-core and d-beat. Anyone have a better handle on it?

def d beat influence seems to the number one thing. the last ten or fifteen years seems to be bands that have a certain guitar tone-tragedy, his hero is gone, severed head of state, etc. i have even heard of bands like catharsis as having a "crust" type of guitar sound, but that seem to be pushing things a little bit.

yourenotevil wrote:

version sound wrote:Honestly, I'm not even sure what defines crust as a musical genre. It can't just be Discharge worship, because that's already pretty well covered by dis-core and d-beat. Anyone have a better handle on it?

def d beat influence seems to the number one thing. the last ten or fifteen years seems to be bands that have a certain guitar tone-tragedy, his hero is gone, severed head of state, etc. i have even heard of bands like catharsis as having a "crust" type of guitar sound, but that seem to be pushing things a little bit.

Interesting. When I think "crust" I usually think of something with gruff vocals and prominent bass.

version sound wrote:

yourenotevil wrote:

version sound wrote:Honestly, I'm not even sure what defines crust as a musical genre. It can't just be Discharge worship, because that's already pretty well covered by dis-core and d-beat. Anyone have a better handle on it?

def d beat influence seems to the number one thing. the last ten or fifteen years seems to be bands that have a certain guitar tone-tragedy, his hero is gone, severed head of state, etc. i have even heard of bands like catharsis as having a "crust" type of guitar sound, but that seem to be pushing things a little bit.

Interesting. When I think "crust" I usually think of something with gruff vocals and prominent bass.

i think that would also work to describe those bands.

version sound wrote:Honestly, I'm not even sure what defines crust as a musical genre. It can't just be Discharge worship, because that's already pretty well covered by dis-core and d-beat. Anyone have a better handle on it?

We had a thread on the old board...

Thing is, crust was a name for idiots that didn't wash that later became a name for 'music'.

http://theappendix.net/issues/2013/7/ru ... -the-1980s


Have a read,and listen to the accompanying soundtrack